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Post by Admin on Feb 20, 2018 11:31:35 GMT -4
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Post by fezzyfezz on Feb 20, 2018 11:53:03 GMT -4
Some comments on the recent rule change proposals:
Yearly Schedule Change- I've been pretty vocal about this change for awhile. I don't think it makes sense for teams to be able to add/drop players with cap money/space after the league playoffs/superbowl. 100% support this change.
Taxi Rules- I know there are a lot of people not a big fan of this change. My biggest reasoning behind this or a similar change that prevents rookies/sophomores who are producing on the taxi is that I don't like any rule that forces an owner to not submit its best lineup. I know people say " well you dont have to do it" but then if the rules allow it, why wouldn't you, if you weren't competing. The easy fix would be for taxi to count towards PP, but i dont believe you can do that with MFL. Perhaps this becomes less of an issue if we change the rookie structure, so that rookie contracts aren't so insanely underpriced.
Rookies Coming Off Deals (1): I really like this rule, because it makes RFA relevant. As it stands, there is basically no reason for any rookie to receive fewer than 4 years, since they are so underpriced and if they "bust" you can just cut them for free/minimal cost depending if they were on your taxi or not. Big fan of this change, and perhaps even going a step further, which I'll outline in a moment.
Rookies Coming Off Deals (2): Definitely prefer the 1st change to this. I think this type of fix basically makes RFA not a thing, and has a less "realistic" feel to it that we like in a cap league. Wouldn't be 100% opposed to it if the above rule doesnt pass, but then I just feel this is an inferior option to option 1.
Ideas worth adding to the doc:
1. Contract Extension Rule. I think we ought to adjust this rule so that you can only give an extension to players with at least 1 year left on their deal. It doesnt make sense that a player would finish his contract, become a free agent, then take a contract extension from their original team without exploring the open market. If we use the RFA rules with rookies, then I like this change even more, since most players eligible for extension would be older vets or undrafted FA. Though I'm not sure if undrafted FA rookies owuld be categorized here or as rookies drafted, that is to the commish team to decide.
2. Set # of years for rookies (with year extension options?) What if we made rookie contracts set to a # of years like they have a fixed contract amount? 1st/2nd rounders get 4 years, 3rd/4th get 3? Or even 2nd/3rd/4th get 3, idk. Then to compensate for this, owners can give players on a rookie deal an extension, either 1 year if they had 4 years, or 1-2 if they had 5 years using standard extension rules, and ideally the above extension rule, where you give it to the player before their final year. This would be similar to a rookie getting a slight raise after 2-3 years when teams take the 4th / 5th year option on a player. After these contracts expire, the player could still go to RFA, or even if a player isn't extended they could go to RFA. The specifics could be ironed out, just an idea that may make rookie deals more "concrete" and less variable, to pair with other rule changes to rookies.
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Post by Dube (Junkyard Dogs) on Feb 20, 2018 14:45:18 GMT -4
My suggestion is a restructure tag. It mixes an idea I had with an idea Joe had. Under the Restructure Tag there can be either a contract extension or reduction. The extension would almost the same as the extension tag we have now but under the umbrella of Restructure Tag. The only difference is an extension could not be used on a player with an expiring contract (Joe's idea). The reduction is totaling up the remanding cost of a contract and dividing it by a shorter length of seasons. I know the argument is that it punishes teams with good cap management but I feel it is also a realistic option, NFL teams negotiate pay cuts and such all the time.Every team would only be allowed one restructure tag so not everyone would be reducing contracts, plus if they do it will hurt their cap for at least the upcoming year so it is a wash there. And the current extension rules are relatively cheep so almost every team will be doing that now instead of using the franchise tag. But with mandating they can't be on expiring contracts, and teams choosing reductions instead of extensions it will create more turn over with not every team extending someone.
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Post by Arlen (DethDynasty) on Feb 20, 2018 17:30:05 GMT -4
I'm reading all of the discussion since yesterday on groupme...***if potential points manipulation were the main concern***, you could just eliminate the MFL component of the taxi squad while keeping it for salary purposes in t. I noticed that only 2 teams have 24 or more total players (IR, active & taxi combined), with most people opting for fewer...if the PP is really the problem, you could just operate the taxi squad *outside of MFL* and have the MFL roster size put at 30 or whatever.
In the event of somebody accidentally (or, I guess, deliberately) starting somebody that was supposed to be taxi squaded and was never promoted, commish can go change the result of that matchup by taking that player out of the scoring and then submit the requisite penalty...and that can all be done at intervals throughout the regular season while you're also checking the 17-game rule. Individual teams might be incentivized to double-check their own H2H matchups to see if they unjustly lost a matchup because of a rule violation.
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Post by dynastydegenerate on Feb 20, 2018 18:09:11 GMT -4
From Joe: Some comments on the recent rule change proposals: Yearly Schedule Change- I've been pretty vocal about this change for awhile. I don't think it makes sense for teams to be able to add/drop players with cap money/space after the league playoffs/superbowl. 100% support this change. Glad we could come to a compromise here. We want to tip toe the line of making sure no game breaking drops/adds occur while also allowing playoff teams to be able to make transactions for their run.Taxi Rules- I know there are a lot of people not a big fan of this change. My biggest reasoning behind this or a similar change that prevents rookies/sophomores who are producing on the taxi is that I don't like any rule that forces an owner to not submit its best lineup. I know people say " well you dont have to do it" but then if the rules allow it, why wouldn't you, if you weren't competing. The easy fix would be for taxi to count towards PP, but i dont believe you can do that with MFL. Perhaps this becomes less of an issue if we change the rookie structure, so that rookie contracts aren't so insanely underpriced. Rookie contracts are under market price with the high bust rate baked in. This past year was an exceptional group of rookies that produced at a high level. Not all rookie classes come out and have multiple players are instantly top 10 at their position. I do understand though that some do, and could potentially effect league standings if they were tucked away on taxi squads. I believe the submission below from Arlen (this addition is already paying dividends) would suffice the hang up on blocking Potential Points. If in MFL we had no taxi then we could calculate PP for all rostered players. We would also keep the Taxi Squad in place in the Spread Sheet so the benefits of having cap relief on developmental players would remain.
Also note with some of the other proposals in place to address the market price of rookies once they come off their entry level deal, we have some potential long term market re-calibration checks in place to address young producers. The beauty of a salary cap league is we are our own market, in a sense. If a team believed in a no namer like Alex Collins or second round rookie pick like Juju Smith Schuster (2.08 in our league) and those players go on to become NFL producers but were undervalued by everyone else, then that owner deserves the low price they are paying. This league was developed with that in mind. Not everything needs to be to NFL scale.
Rookies Coming Off Deals (1): I really like this rule, because it makes RFA relevant. As it stands, there is basically no reason for any rookie to receive fewer than 4 years, since they are so underpriced and if they "bust" you can just cut them for free/minimal cost depending if they were on your taxi or not. Big fan of this change, and perhaps even going a step further, which I'll outline in a moment. I am also a fan of this deal and I touched on it a little bit above without calling it by name. I agree it would give more significance to the RFA off season feature.Rookies Coming Off Deals (2): Definitely prefer the 1st change to this. I think this type of fix basically makes RFA not a thing, and has a less "realistic" feel to it that we like in a cap league. Wouldn't be 100% opposed to it if the above rule doesnt pass, but then I just feel this is an inferior option to option 1. This was developed along with the one above to give options. Ideas worth adding to the doc: 1. Contract Extension Rule. I think we ought to adjust this rule so that you can only give an extension to players with at least 1 year left on their deal. It doesnt make sense that a player would finish his contract, become a free agent, then take a contract extension from their original team without exploring the open market. If we use the RFA rules with rookies, then I like this change even more, since most players eligible for extension would be older vets or undrafted FA. Though I'm not sure if undrafted FA rookies owuld be categorized here or as rookies drafted, that is to the commish team to decide. The current way we have is makes things much cleaner and easy to view for all league owners and admin. It makes sense in the fact that when their contract is expired, you extend them. You only get 1 extension per off season (as well as 1 franchise tag per off-season), so there is some strategy involved in not just handing out your one extension per year, but also signing players. If you sign someone new, you have to think about if you might want to extend them down the road - which year their contract expires and who else might be coming off contract that year. Its really really straightforward in that sense, which i think is the most appealing thing about it. I think you are getting hung up on the language here of becoming a free agent but then getting extended. One, it does happen in the NFL like that, so its not like it never happens. Two, my goal was never to have a cap league that exactly mimicked the NFL and I created a league that had settings you thought were the most fun as well as easy for owners to learn and commish's to implement. The way it is set now accomplishes that.
Also many teams have constructed their teams with this in mind. It would be very messy to adjust something like this now. I have no interest in it, and it likely wont be on proposal list when we vote. Standing firm here.
2. Set # of years for rookies (with year extension options?) What if we made rookie contracts set to a # of years like they have a fixed contract amount? 1st/2nd rounders get 4 years, 3rd/4th get 3? Or even 2nd/3rd/4th get 3, idk. Then to compensate for this, owners can give players on a rookie deal an extension, either 1 year if they had 4 years, or 1-2 if they had 5 years using standard extension rules, and ideally the above extension rule, where you give it to the player before their final year. This would be similar to a rookie getting a slight raise after 2-3 years when teams take the 4th / 5th year option on a player. After these contracts expire, the player could still go to RFA, or even if a player isn't extended they could go to RFA. The specifics could be ironed out, just an idea that may make rookie deals more "concrete" and less variable, to pair with other rule changes to rookies. I believe the Rookies Coming Off Deals (1) would accomplish adjusting the market price for the career of rookies that "hit". I don't want to over complicate things. Like i mentioned in my doc to the league earlier, we all really like this league and I am not ready to start tinkering with things just for the sake of tinkering with it. Rookies have inherit risk and should be rewarded for hits. If we pass the motion to adjust their 2nd contract like we've mentioned here that is enough for me and i think for most to keep things simple, but also fair. I also stand firm on this.
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Post by dynastydegenerate on Feb 20, 2018 18:11:02 GMT -4
I'm reading all of the discussion since yesterday on groupme...***if potential points manipulation were the main concern***, you could just eliminate the MFL component of the taxi squad while keeping it for salary purposes in t. I noticed that only 2 teams have 24 or more total players (IR, active & taxi combined), with most people opting for fewer...if the PP is really the problem, you could just operate the taxi squad *outside of MFL* and have the MFL roster size put at 30 or whatever. In the event of somebody accidentally (or, I guess, deliberately) starting somebody that was supposed to be taxi squaded and was never promoted, commish can go change the result of that matchup by taking that player out of the scoring and then submit the requisite penalty...and that can all be done at intervals throughout the regular season while you're also checking the 17-game rule. Individual teams might be incentivized to double-check their own H2H matchups to see if they unjustly lost a matchup because of a rule violation. I think this would be a very fair compromise
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Post by Wildcard on Feb 20, 2018 18:37:13 GMT -4
My suggestion is a restructure tag. It mixes an idea I had with an idea Joe had. Under the Restructure Tag there can be either a contract extension or reduction. The extension would almost the same as the extension tag we have now but under the umbrella of Restructure Tag. The only difference is an extension could not be used on a player with an expiring contract (Joe's idea). The reduction is totaling up the remanding cost of a contract and dividing it by a shorter length of seasons. I know the argument is that it punishes teams with good cap management but I feel it is also a realistic option, NFL teams negotiate pay cuts and such all the time.Every team would only be allowed one restructure tag so not everyone would be reducing contracts, plus if they do it will hurt their cap for at least the upcoming year so it is a wash there. And the current extension rules are relatively cheep so almost every team will be doing that now instead of using the franchise tag. But with mandating they can't be on expiring contracts, and teams choosing reductions instead of extensions it will create more turn over with not every team extending someone. In regards to a reduction, the total amount of the contract would stay the same? You are just able to take the whole hit in a shorter time?
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Feb 20, 2018 19:03:37 GMT -4
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Post by dynastydegenerate on Feb 20, 2018 19:03:37 GMT -4
My suggestion is a restructure tag. It mixes an idea I had with an idea Joe had. Under the Restructure Tag there can be either a contract extension or reduction. The extension would almost the same as the extension tag we have now but under the umbrella of Restructure Tag. The only difference is an extension could not be used on a player with an expiring contract (Joe's idea). The reduction is totaling up the remanding cost of a contract and dividing it by a shorter length of seasons. I know the argument is that it punishes teams with good cap management but I feel it is also a realistic option, NFL teams negotiate pay cuts and such all the time.Every team would only be allowed one restructure tag so not everyone would be reducing contracts, plus if they do it will hurt their cap for at least the upcoming year so it is a wash there. And the current extension rules are relatively cheep so almost every team will be doing that now instead of using the franchise tag. But with mandating they can't be on expiring contracts, and teams choosing reductions instead of extensions it will create more turn over with not every team extending someone. In regards to a reduction, the total amount of the contract would stay the same? You are just able to take the whole hit in a shorter time? I don't love the idea of handing out semi-mulligans. I would rather focus on developing rules focused on funneling owners into making wise cap decisions. I kinda feel like the reduction aspect rewards those that made poor cap decisions and in year 2 we are gonna hand out a get out of jail card. Idk I think I like the idea of a loyalty extension but I kinda prefer to just let everything go unaffected and let the market and teams do the correcting with time. Anyone feel free to weigh in here
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Post by fezzyfezz on Feb 21, 2018 1:44:19 GMT -4
Yeah I'm not really a fan of allowing a contract amount to be reduced at anytime. Perhaps an alternative would be a restructuring of the contract per year, where you could frontload or backload a deal (10/15/20 vs 15/15/15) but I think if you did this, you'd have to make it front load only so people dont backload contracts and later leave (not saying anyone would). Still, its another thing to have to track, and while I think it'd be cool to restructure a contract to frontload it, I'm not a huge fan of the side effects that result of it.
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Post by fezzyfezz on Feb 22, 2018 11:29:14 GMT -4
Some thoughts on the "Rookies Coming off Deals (1)" Proposal:
Would this rule apply for undrafted free agent rookies? With only 48 rookies drafted, there are going to be more than a couple rookies that get signed after the fact. Maybe a potential fix would be a 5th round rookie pick, for those bottom guys, give them min. contracts of 0.25 (vs. the 0.5 of 4th rounders) but allow those players to get RFA at the end of the deal. Or just give UDFA "rookie RFA" status at the end of those deals. Just sort of theory crafting options, though I do like the idea of an additional round for rookies, gives more weight to late picks since you are gettin the "rookie RFA" rule bonus assuming that passes. Guess it depends on how commish team was planning to apply this rule to UDFAs. The only thing in the description seemed to indicate UDFAs WOULDNT get "rookie RFA" status, since the language says its a deal that was designated by wage scale. IDK, just throwing this out there, it could all be moot if the rule doesnt pass (but hopefully it will!).
2nd thought: would this rule apply to all players currently on rookie deals? Or only to the new rookie deals.
Thanks.
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Post by Admin on Feb 24, 2018 12:41:58 GMT -4
UDFA's will function as they always have. The rule your asking about Will Only be geared towards rookies Drafted in Our league.
your 2nd though, this woud retro activate
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